Newcomer to Pilotaware who is just a bit too dense to understand the basics 😊

[Admin]

Hi
Can you take a look at the status page 192.168.1.1  to see what is reported, please post a screenshot, that would help

Thx
Lee

[FERRYAIR]

Hopefully these screenprints will give you an idea of what is happening?

These screenprints were taken after I had managed to see a few of our inbounds this morning (31/10/2015 ) so may not be giving the issues I encountered yesterday?

[FERRYAIR]

Having played with Pilotaware now for 4 days I am either doing something completely different & stupid each time I try to get it running.

I power up the Pilotaware unit, then start up pilotaware android app, then start up Skydemon.

Sometimes it starts up without any issues, sometimes the Skydemon just hangs as getting GPS satellites ( in location mode the position is instantly found ) in flarm Sod all !!!!

Is there a set process to get it running everytime?

Also when ' working ' it is only showing a few contacts, whilst our TCAS on the aircraft is putting contacts everywhere.

Go figure !!!!

[Admin]

Hi Ferryair

What the display is telling you is the following

1. it has received 30 GPS Packets(over TCP) (0 in the last 5 seconds)
2. it has received 4119 ADS-B Packets (2 in the last 5 seconds)

Firstly, it should be receiving GPS Packets all the time, the fact that it has not received any in the last 5 seconds is suspicious
also 2 ADS-B packets in the last 5 seconds is pretty poor.

Do you have the ADS-B Antenna connected, and does it have a (reasonably) good view of the sky ?

Thx
Lee

[FERRYAIR]

Perhaps I am being rather dumb but how do you know 1. it has received 30 GPS Packets(over TCP) (0 in the last 5 seconds) 2. it has received 4119 ADS-B Packets (2 in the last 5 seconds)  ?

This is all a bit of a Black Art ?  I have always been reliant on my eyes to see conflicts but I am spending more time in IMC so I thought the PAW would assist me, the 2 aerials are both coreectly attached, the internal disco lights flicker away relentlessly, the Pilotaware App shows a position that seems to be right for my locality, just the SD that hangs 90% of the time.

Much as it isn't the ideal set up, the XCSOAR TE fires up every time and shows more returns in my area than on SD

Is there something about the signal dying if the unit is stationary?   I only ask because in the Chopper it only showed conflicts whilst the chopper was moving.... in the hover  Sod all.

Hi Ferryair

What the display is telling you is the following

1. it has received 30 GPS Packets(over TCP) (0 in the last 5 seconds)
2. it has received 4119 ADS-B Packets (2 in the last 5 seconds)

Firstly, it should be receiving GPS Packets all the time, the fact that it has not received any in the last 5 seconds is suspicious
also 2 ADS-B packets in the last 5 seconds is pretty poor.

Do you have the ADS-B Antenna connected, and does it have a (reasonably) good view of the sky ?

Thx
Lee

[chrismills]

Instructions

1. Build your PilotAware box and get a licence code from Lee.
2. Download PilotAwareAndroid from the PlayStore to your phone (or tablet). This device must have GPS receiver.
3. Set up your Nav Software. This will depend on which software you have but Lee has posted instructions elsewhere on the forum.

          For SkyDemon you need to make the following changes
               Settings>Setup>Navigation Options>Other Traffic>Show Within Vertically  =  50000ft
               Settings>Setup>Connectivity Options>External GPS/Traffic Source = FLARM
               Settings>Setup>Connectivity Options>FLARM Options>Air Connect Key  =  6000

4. Power up your PilotAware box and wait patiently for it to finish booting. This takes about 20 seconds on my unit.The best way to tell is to look at you devices WiFi settings. You'll see the PilotAware WiFI access point(AP) appear. It should look something like PilotAware-1234567890

5. Connect the PilotAwareAndroid device to the PilotAware WiFi AP. This is an open network and no password is required.
6. Start the PilotAwareAndroid software. The top line of the display will confirm you are connnected to the right AP.
7. Wait for a GPS fix to be made. The rest of the PilotAwareAndroid display will be populated with live data and update regularly.

8. Connect your Nav device to the same PilotAware AP as above (PilotAware-1234567890).
9. Start your Nav software if not already.
10. Go Flying

          Again, in Skydemon when you click "Go Flying" you need to chose "FLARM location". Sometimes takes a few moments to update at this stage.
          Unless you're in a GA ADS-B rich area the most likely traffic you will see is high level commercial flights.
         Once you're happy the system is working it probably makes sense to go back and alter the >Other Traffic>Show Within Vertically setting

Hope this helps

Chris
         

I presume you're following these instructions from the "Android" thread. Also set up as per instructions in the "3rd Party" thread.

Could you be specific about what devices you are using for GPS source and Skydemon display.

It's worth bearing in mind that although your phone/tablet may have a GPS receiver built in, it's not really designed for supplying constant GPS data like we need. These devices are designed and build to optimize battery life and that means turning stuff off, keeping CPU usage to a minimum and generally running low power hardware. I don't know about iOS but the Android operating system monitors CPU and memory usage and caches or even kills apps which are not being actively used or which are taking up too much space. Your best bet is to plug a USB GPS dongle into the PAW box.

Chris

[Admin]

You say xcsoar shows more traffic than SD, ahaaa
Have you changed the vertical traffic filter in SD, as Chris mentions, this is in the instructions

Thx
Lee

[FERRYAIR]

The Vertical traffic filter is set to 50000ft So yes I have it set to the maximum I can 

xcsoar is not that great either but it seems to show more conflicts than SD is showing.

I suspect that some of my poor returns are from the Window ledge scenario ( makes sense as I am  trying it from an east facing window and the returns are mainly showing east of my position )  however the airborne tests weren't much better and didn't show everything in the vicinity.

Today it seemed to work better when tested from a different mode of transport, I even got a conflict of traffic that was below us....... not usually something to concern you too much about except I was at sea level on a motor cruiser 😃

You say xcsoar shows more traffic than SD, ahaaa
Have you changed the vertical traffic filter in SD, as Chris mentions, this is in the instructions

Thx
Lee

[chrismills]

ferryair, you're posts say "I'm stupid, I'm clueless, maybe I'm dumb"

You're imposing an unfair burden on people who would be more productive helping other people

Not exactly a productive post, but then neither is this one I guess.....

We're here to support development. I think that included bug fixing and troubleshooting at the moment. The more PAW is adopted, the better for all. Some will need a bit of help and encouragement.

Chris

[neilmurg]

ferryair, you're posts say...

Not exactly a productive post...
Chris

Yes I agree, so I deleted it.

[FERRYAIR]

Finally got my PAW working to a fashion, picking up a  lot more stuff but it still seems to need reboot every 5-20minutes ( varies )

I still think that I must be doing something wrong when I initialise it each time because if I am not getting it wrong I can only opine that the PAW isn't completely User friendly.

[Admin]

Finally got my PAW working to a fashion, picking up a  lot more stuff but it still seems to need reboot every 5-20minutes ( varies )

I still think that I must be doing something wrong when I initialise it each time because if I am not getting it wrong I can only opine that the PAW isn't completely User friendly.

Hi Ferryair,
Please remember we are still in a Beta Trial phase for PilotAware, this is not yet a polished product.
In these circumstances 'User Friendliness' is our aim, and not yet our acheivement.

As part of a Beta trial it is absolutely imperative that we receive accurate, deep and thorugh feedback from our users in order to investigate potential design related issues, or to provide feedback for user related issues.

So can I ask you to please elaborate on your reporting so we can investigate fully.

The information we need to know is
1. 'picking up a lot more stuff',
-    What is not being picked up ?
-    What are you comparing against for 'not being picked up' ?
-    What is the distance of traffic that you are seeing, compared to what you would expect to see ?

2.  'reboot every 5-20minutes'
-    What is the reason for a reboot ?
-    Do you lose a GPS connection ?
-    Do you lose a 'butterfly' connection ?
-    Do you lose a WiFi connection ?
-    Do you see an error message, if so, what is the error message and where does the error message come from ?
-    If you still have WiFi, can you interrogate the web page 192.168.1.1, and if so what does it report ?

Please try to answer all of the questions above, I know it can seem difficult and time consuming, but the more
detailed information we can get, then the better chance we have of diagnosing the issues quickly.

Thx
Lee

[FERRYAIR]

[/quote]

Hi Ferryair,
Please remember we are still in a Beta Trial phase for PilotAware, this is not yet a polished product.
In these circumstances 'User Friendliness' is our aim, and not yet our acheivement.

As part of a Beta trial it is absolutely imperative that we receive accurate, deep and thorugh feedback from our users in order to investigate potential design related issues, or to provide feedback for user related issues.

So can I ask you to please elaborate on your reporting so we can investigate fully.

The information we need to know is
1. 'picking up a lot more stuff',
# I seem to now be getting a lot of the Bucket & Spade Traffic, but no low level GA Traffic. The GA stuff is around because it shows up on the FR24 & DYNON which is on ADS-B LINK UP. #

-    What is not being picked up ?
# GA Traffic is not showing up, I know some don't have Transponders but the majority of Edinburgh Located stuff does #  * The Trig Helicopter certainly has Mode S onboard and that is never picked up on PAW *

-    What are you comparing against for 'not being picked up' ?
# Comparing to FR24 & DYNON SET UP #

-    What is the distance of traffic that you are seeing, compared to what you would expect to see ?
# First few times I only saw stuff at high altitudes up to 45000ft but very few low level stuff except the depart/arrive stuff from Edinburgh that seems to disappear passing 5000ft and then reappear at 25000ft upwards. Recently I can pick up  Bucket & Spade traffic as far south as Humberside & as far North as Lossiemouth, but still no low level stuff ( which is where I operate ) #

2.  'reboot every 5-20minutes?
# The reboot is the only way of refreshing the overlay of possible conflicts, I can have a screen full of Bucket & Spade stuff that will just disappear but return on a reboot #

-    What is the reason for a reboot ?
# See answer above, the difference in timescale is dependant on when conflicts all disappear at same time #

-    Do you lose a GPS connection ?
# Sometimes it is GPS connection that pops off for a snooze or I get the red Skydemon warning that it has gone into offline mode.#

-    Do you lose a 'butterfly' connection ?
# Not that I am aware off? My technology knowledge is pretty dire #

-    Do you lose a WiFi connection ?
# Yes, I am guessing that is what causes the Red Skydemon warning #

-    Do you see an error message, if so, what is the error message and where does the error message come from ?
# Not had any error messages other than Red Skydemon offline message #

-    If you still have WiFi, can you interrogate the web page 192.168.1.1, and if so what does it report ?
# I am totally IT inept so I can't see anything when I tried 192.168.1.1, except a load of google links to various sites #

Please try to answer all of the questions above, I know it can seem difficult and time consuming, but the more
detailed information we can get, then the better chance we have of diagnosing the issues quickly.
# Answered as best I can #

Thx
Lee
[/quote]

[Paul_Sengupta]

Flight Radar 24 has multi-lateration, so if someone has a Mode S transponder without ADS-B it can pinpoint it using triangulation from various receiver sites.

PilotAware will ONLY pick up ADS-B traffic, i.e. if the traffic has a linked GPS and the transponder is ADS-B capable, reporting its position. There's the occasional GA aircraft which has this, but they're a bit thin on the ground (er, or in the air) at the moment.

With the ARF, the PilotAware will also pick up other PilotAware equipped aeroplanes.

What does the Dynon pick up? Is the antenna different to that on the PAW?

[FERRYAIR]

Flight Radar 24 has multi-lateration, so if someone has a Mode S transponder without ADS-B it can pinpoint it using triangulation from various receiver sites.

# Ah, now everything is becoming clear, I won't get to see all the Mode S transponder equipped GA stuff that plays around in my lower airspace, so really I am only being safeguarded from not colliding with the Bucket & Spade Traffic?  For the amount of times I am up in FL Whatever, I already have TCAS in those aircraft #

PilotAware will ONLY pick up ADS-B traffic, i.e. if the traffic has a linked GPS and the transponder is ADS-B capable, reporting its position. There's the occasional GA aircraft which has this, but they're a bit thin on the ground (er, or in the air) at the moment.
# The GPS and the transponder are linked & ADS-B capable in a few of the aircraft I fly, in one particular aircraft it is also somehow linked into the Dynon & shows The Traffic around me !!!! #

With the ARF, the PilotAware will also pick up other PilotAware equipped aeroplanes.
# OK this now raises the question of " How many PAW users are there in Scotland?  " Is that information known to The Admin Team?    I am guessing that I'm going to find out I am an orphan up here 😂  #

What does the Dynon pick up? Is the antenna different to that on the PAW?
# The Dynon picks up the ADS-B Traffic & I assumed the Mode S stuff ( which until now I thought was one & the same ) How exactly it transposes from the magic box to the screen is unknown to me? The Antenna linked to the Dynon is visually the same as a Transponder aerial ( the aircraft has 2 of the aerials that look like a replicant of a tongue piercing stud, one at the position immediately below the centre console between the crew & the second is half way along the fuselage #