PilotAware
British Forum => Technical Support => Topic started by: Smaragd on July 22, 2019, 10:07:58 pm
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HI,
Have been using the latest software for a couple of weeks with EasyVFR; was disappointed that I hadn't detected any MLAT targets. Made a longer flight today from Bath to Rugby and noticed that a few MLAT targets appeared on the traffic page, and audio warnings were given, but no target was displayed on EVFR. Disappointingly not even a bearingless Mode-S (presumably because it's no longer bearingless),though other non-MLAT bearingless Mode-S targets were displayed.
Am I missing something simple?
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Hi Trevor,
I take it you have enabled Mode-S/3D in your PAW Configure Screen? It is ‘off’ by default and that part of the Configure Screen doesn’t appear until after you have entered and saved your licence key.
Regards
Peter
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..........having read the terms & conditions first, of course ;D
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Hi smaragd
If you let me have your HEXID I can check whether you were seen by the groundstations
next is to get a track file and look at contents
I will email you direct ...
PilotAware Team
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G-DENS, HexID 40263C
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Seen by the following stations
1 PWEGHS
1 PWTruthe
7 PWEGLM
177 PWNewbury
364 PWBath
551 PWCalneW
1077 PWKemble
1586 PWSHIREN
Please confirm you have enabled Mode-S/3D on the configure page
PilotAware Team
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Thanks Lee. I believe I have, but will triple check when I next get to the aircraft (Saturday).
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Hi Smaragd
Can I ask if you are using EVFR3.xxx or are you Beta testing EV4. I ask because so far in EV4 it does not display the aircraft Icons on the map. There is only the tiny centre circle from the Icon but the text does display and change colour correctly and even shows the ambiguity rings.
I have reported this to Rob Weijers but he's still too busy with all the major work on implementing the various elements of the new software. He did respond to me and here is a quote from that email.
Quote:To be honest I have no clue at all yet, and I haven't been able to dig into this yet. Part of the problem is of course its so difficult for me to test, since there is no way for me to get such a MLAT datafeed to my system.
So my plan is to somewhere in the future write a little data-traffic capture capability in EV4, and then ask you to capture some data for me. But to be honest that won't be before august, :EndQuote
I haven't noticed any problems with my regular copy of EVFR3.
Alan
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I'm using EVFR 3.97, so that's not the problem.
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Hi smaragd
Let us step back to the original post so we can understand the thought process.....
was disappointed that I hadn't detected any MLAT targets. Made a longer flight today from Bath to Rugby and noticed that a few MLAT targets appeared on the traffic page, and audio warnings were given, but no target was displayed on EVFR.
How did you determine that no MLAT targets appeared in EVFR,
Firstly, what were you expecting to see, that identifies a traffic target specifically as an MLAT target - as opposed to any other type ?
Secondly, what connection method do you use in EVFR PilotAware, GDL90 or Flarm ?
Thx
Lee
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Hi smaragd
Let us step back to the original post so we can understand the thought process.....
was disappointed that I hadn't detected any MLAT targets. Made a longer flight today from Bath to Rugby and noticed that a few MLAT targets appeared on the traffic page, and audio warnings were given, but no target was displayed on EVFR.
How did you determine that no MLAT targets appeared in EVFR,
Firstly, what were you expecting to see, that identifies a traffic target specifically as an MLAT target - as opposed to any other type ?
Secondly, what connection method do you use in EVFR PilotAware, GDL90 or Flarm ?
Thx
Lee
To answer the second first, I have set it up as per the instructions at https://pilotaware.com/easyvfr/, with (Step 4) FLARM on and Flarm as GPS off; I get a FLARM caption top left on the display. For the first, I was expecting to see ambiguity circles but have seen none on any of my recent flights. As an example, I had MLAT traffic at around 9 o'clock, 8km (I seem to remember) which was listed on the traffic page but which was not visible on the EVFR display. There were several other audio warnings of near traffic (for which I didn't have time to check the traffic page) but nothing on the display.
I'll check my settings on Saturday - though I did so prior to my last flight - and even if they are correct, perhaps I'll delete and re-enter them. Don't put too much thought into it at the moment, Lee, if I'm the only one with the problem, I'll make sure it's not finger trouble on my part first.
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Ok that answers it
To show mlat with ambiguity on evfr you need to choose gdl90
You can show mlat without ambiguity selecting udp/2000 flarm or Pilotaware
Thx
Lee
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was disappointed that I hadn't detected any MLAT targets. Made a longer flight today from Bath to Rugby and noticed that a few MLAT targets appeared on the traffic page, and audio warnings were given, but no target was displayed on EVFR.
I had MLAT traffic at around 9 o'clock, 8km (I seem to remember) which was listed on the traffic page but which was not visible on the EVFR display. There were several other audio warnings of near traffic (for which I didn't have time to check the traffic page) but nothing on the display.
I'm a little confused here.
MLAT targets will appear the same as PilotAware, FLARM, or ADSB targets. They will be shown regardless of the protocol chosen. Smaragd has stated that they do not appear at all, rather than they are missing the ambiguity circles?
Is Smaragd confusing ambiguity circles with the three Mode C/S threat rings around his own aircraft? Which of course he won't see for an MLAT target.
Cheers
Ian
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Hi Ian et al
Initially MLAT was only sent over GDL90, this was as relaxed to include PilotAware on SD (flarm over udp)
I think flarm over tcp, may not have been included in sending mlat
Thx
Lee
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Re the last three emails from Ian and Admin - where is any of that information contained in the PAW documentation? No wonder I am in the dark! The EVFR documentation at https://pilotaware.com/easyvfr/ makes no mention of GDL90, only of FLARM. Also I don't understand Ian's reference to three Mode C/S rings about own aircraft - I haven't seen those either.
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Hi Ian / Trevor / Lee,
Now I’m confused.
Ian - AFAIU EasyVFR still shows the ‘ambiguity circles’. They were only turned off by SkyDemon.
Trevor - The 3 concentric coloured rings Ian is referring to are SkyDemon’s way of showing Bearingless targets ‘on screen’. On SkyDemon, they start as a large green ring when the target reaches the first threat trigger point, then progress through smaller Amber and red rings as the threat increases, in the same way as EasyVFR does using the coloured warning banners and AIUI, you also still get these Bearingless alerts when using GDL90 (which SkyDemon Users don’t).
We SD users have had to make a choice of using GDL90 if we want to see MLAT or FLARM (TCP) / PilotAware (UDP) connectivity if we want to see Bearingless target rings.
My confusion arises from Lee’s post. Lee are you saying that we can now get MLAT on PilotAware UDP as well as the Bearingless target rings on SkyDemon? If so, that’s a new one on me.
Regards
Peter
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Regarding smaragd post, the documentation is missing the details about MLAT, we need to fix that, this is the definitive statement
GDL90
includes MLAT and NACp figure to derive ambiguity circles
EasyVFR will use the NACp figure, SD will discard these figures
PilotAware (UDP)
includes MLAT, but no way (no syntax) to describe NACp, therefore no ambiguity circles
EasyVFR and SD will display traffic, no ambiguity circles
Flarm (TCP)
Currently contains no MLAT data, this will probably be added in the next version
Hope that clears any confusion, it will be added to the documentation
Thx
Lee
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Ah! So presumably on EVFR I need to select Menu, Nav Settings, GDL90 settings - then what?
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Hi Trevor,
EVFR has pre-populated GDL90 settings; IP address 0.0.0.0; Port 4000; UDP
So select “Use GDL90” and maybe turn to “ON” Use GDL 90 GPS (PAW) as EVFR GPS.
However when trying it I suspect I may still had “Use Flarm” in Flarm settings enabled. It seems that it allows you to simultaneously use both protocols, so make sure you deselect Flarm before enabling GDL90!
Thx,
Chris
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Many thanks Chris, done that, will try it out on Saturday.
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One query to the experts: before, with USE FLARM selected (and no to use GPS), opening EVFR would eventually give me a GPS fix caption, then when PAW was ready a FLARM caption - so I knew PAW was feeding data to EVFR. Now I've changed to GDL90 and am running it at home with PAW out of range in the aircraft, and I'm getting GPS Fix and GDL90 captions. What's the GDL90 caption telling me - clearly not that PAW is working at the moment? And when I get back to the aircraft is there anything that can tell me that data is actually being fed from the PAW to EVFR?
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If using gdl90, select gdl90 as the protocol on the paw configure page
Rather than auto
Thx
Lee
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Thanks again Lee.
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If using gdl90, select gdl90 as the protocol on the paw configure page
Rather than auto
Thx
Lee
Hi Lee, an inconclusive result from my flight yesterday - mainly due to a scarcity of aircraft flying around! However a colleague has just loaded the latest software on his PAW and uses SD not EVFR; does he also need to select gdl90 as the protocol on the paw configure page? And is there any setting on SD that needs to change with this new software compared to the previous version?
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For SD connect using PilotAware
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Hi Lee, a rather long break since my last post, largely due to weather. and a lack of traffic when I have been flying. However I flew today and for the first time saw an MLAT target with ambiguity circle, on EVFR, so my settings are now correct. Thanks for your help.
Trevor
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Hi Trevor
good news - thanks for the update
Thx
Lee