PilotAware

British Forum => General Discussion => Topic started by: Wadoadi on June 16, 2018, 09:25:35 am

Title: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on June 16, 2018, 09:25:35 am
Hi,
    I saw a post/page with the pricing on, but does anyone know when we will be able to order the upgrade?

Also, if I want to change to a PI3 at the same time (I have one spare) it will change the MAC address which I’m guessing means my licence won’t work, so is there a way to have it reassigned?

Thanks
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Paul_Sengupta on June 16, 2018, 09:30:48 am
Yes, you can message Lee and he can change the licence over to the new Pi.
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on June 17, 2018, 07:31:56 pm
Thanks Paul, do you know when I can order an upgrade?
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Paul_Sengupta on June 18, 2018, 02:31:07 pm
No idea, sorry!
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Admin on June 18, 2018, 03:32:05 pm
this will be announced shortly
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on June 19, 2018, 08:23:24 am
Thank you.

Last question for now!

I know Rosetta uses the PI3B, but if I wanted to use the PI3B+ will it work?

I know the small increase in clock speed may have upped the power consumption, however the improved shielding may be of benefit...
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: exfirepro on June 19, 2018, 08:31:11 am
Hi Wadoadi,

Nice to see you back on the Forum!

Short answer is that the Pi3 B+ uses a slightly different setup and the current software won’t run on it, so at present only the Pi3B is supported.

Regards

Peter
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on June 19, 2018, 01:49:15 pm
Thanks Peter, Nice to have been missed! :)

I have ordered my upgrade and the original bridge board is in the post back to Pilotaware (will arrive tomorrow), I have included both my existing Pi 2B and my PI 3B MAC addresses in the hope the label will be printed and licence swapped over in one move ;)

I have also asked if I could have a splitter cable for the SDR for the weather I already have one low power SDR so I may as well put it to use :)
if there is an additional cost may be some can message me I can pay it over the phone...
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Keithvinning on June 22, 2018, 07:50:32 pm
Hi
Every time I read your posts I think of Wodadli the local beer of Antigua and Barbuda.  8)
Anyway. Yes we will change over your MAC address of course.
We are still waiting for the special cables from the supplier in the far East

Keith
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on June 22, 2018, 11:47:52 pm
Haha I must try that beer, cheers Keith. it arrived today simple to put together and reload, all working...


Wadoadi is my old gamers tag and comes from Wado for Wado Ryu Karate and my name Adi (Adrian).
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on June 24, 2018, 08:28:08 pm
Upgrade built! Will be test flying it during the week.

Suggest anyone doing the upgrade drill the aerial holes with 7mm drill bit as the instructions say may be needed.

I have also cut the label down so that it doesn’t block any of the ventilation holes.

I kept my existing 5 dbi 1090 aerial, the kit comes with a 3dbi aerial.

Lastly as the case supplied is not one of the translucent ones, thus it is not possible to see the power and status lights, l will adding two 1 or 2mm holes to allow these to be seen.

It was nice not to have to drill, fill and file out holes! Also the SMA holes line up and will provide more support.

Would like to know how to enable the weather trial, I have a second low power SDR, and I know I will only get it when fly down south!

Also looking forward to when the artificial horizon is available...
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: exfirepro on June 24, 2018, 10:58:38 pm
Adi,

Good to hear your upgrade went well.

Once you have done the upgrade, implementing weather reception is pretty straightforward. When you plug in the second SDR and power up your Rosetta, the software (20180520 on) recognises 2x SDRs and programs the second one to receive 978MHz automatically. You also need to replace the single pigtail with a Y splitter pigtail to feed both SDRs off the single (1090MHz) antenna - or you could use a single antenna tuned for the weaker 978MHz signals instead (1090MHz signals are generally much stronger).

Regards

Peter
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on June 24, 2018, 11:05:45 pm
thanks Peter, Y cable is on order from some faraway land!

I may have an aerial tunned to a frequency close to that... other then the second SDR showing in the home screen is there any other indication of it being enabled, it may be a while before I fly near a trial transmitter!

My second SDR is also a low power V2 SDR.
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Keithvinning on June 24, 2018, 11:34:32 pm
Hi W

Be careful standard Y cables wont fit into the Rosetta Case. This is because the parallel connection is done at the SMA end and the ones that we have seen on t'internet are too big and bulky.

We are having some made to our specification to avoid this.

If you are lucky and get one that is not big and bulky and fits like Cinderella's slipper let us know.
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on June 24, 2018, 11:37:06 pm
Will do!

Please also let me know when I can order one of yours Keith

Thanks
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Keithvinning on June 24, 2018, 11:38:19 pm
Hope to get the samples to test soon.
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on June 24, 2018, 11:40:34 pm
great news, fingers crossed!
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: exfirepro on June 25, 2018, 09:13:31 am
Adi,

Keith is (of course) correct that the thicker ‘back end’ of the SMA on the type of splitter where both pigtails originate at the SMA (as opposed to being spliced in part way along the cable) won’t fit into the cutout in the Rosetta Bridge. I suppose we should refer to this type as a ‘V’ splitter rather than a ‘Y’ splitter.

It does however fit perfectly in the antenna cutout underneath the Raspberry Pi, with the pigtails routed out through the small cutouts beneath the USB / Ethernet Ports at the other end to the SDRs.

Apart from the extra dongle reporting in the USB devices section at the bottom of the Home Screen, there is no other indication until 978MHz data is received, when this will be reported in the ‘ADSB’ row of the Homescreen (see screenshot). (On that occasion BTW, I didn’t get enough data to give me a full weather picture and haven’t been back south since).

Regards

Peter
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on June 25, 2018, 08:37:29 pm
thanks Peter
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on July 02, 2018, 07:12:51 pm
Well, my cables arrived today for my Pilotaware and that of a friend.

I found they seemed to fit ok so long as you have the cables parallel to the board.

So that's two more Pilotaware's that can receive weather now to fly somewhere that transmits it! guess the cost and ability to join the transmission of weather trial as a ground station is costly?

Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on July 02, 2018, 07:17:49 pm
These are the ones I ordered https://www.aliexpress.com/item/SMA-TS9-Adapter-SMA-Female-to-Y-type-2-X-TS9-Male-Connector-Splitter-Combiner-Cable/1000001913663.html (https://www.aliexpress.com/item/SMA-TS9-Adapter-SMA-Female-to-Y-type-2-X-TS9-Male-Connector-Splitter-Combiner-Cable/1000001913663.html)

Make sure you select the RG316 option for the SMA to MCX
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: exfirepro on July 02, 2018, 07:38:50 pm
Hi Adi,

Well done. Just a minor point - I notice your Homepage is indicating ‘Throttled=0x50005’, which indicates a power supply issue possibly due to adding the extra SDR. I take it you are using the standard power cable. Just check your supply is rated to supply a minimum of 2Amps at 5 Volts.

Regards

Peter
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on July 02, 2018, 07:42:00 pm
I wondered what that was! I’m using a 20swg short cable and a 2.1A battery pack!
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: exfirepro on July 02, 2018, 07:45:04 pm
Strange, that should be ok with 2x low power SDRs - mine runs that and a fan! If it’s running, keep an eye on it and let us know what happens.

Peter
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on July 02, 2018, 08:18:54 pm
Ok so here are my non scientific findings!
I have two battery packs one states 2.4A out the other 2.1 cpu shows throttled hex 50005 under voltage.

Plug pilotaware into a pi mains supply OxO so all ok

Plug the Pi into a 3A mains usb supply using the same cable as with the battery packs 0x0

Using a different 20awg cable with original battery 0x50005

So looks like only certain battery packs will do and my Rav packs are not good enough 😭
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on July 02, 2018, 08:40:56 pm
Peter, which battery pack do you use?

Also where are you picking up the 5v for your fan?

Last question :)
Do you think the more efficient power supply in in the 3B+ will overcome some of these issues when it’s suppoted?
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: exfirepro on July 02, 2018, 11:33:38 pm
Hi Adi,

1). In the plane, I use a Charge 4 power supply https://charge4.harkwood.co.uk

A cheaper alternative I have also used is the Anker PowerDrive 5 https://www.amazon.co.uk/PowerDrive-5-Port-Charging-iPhone-Galaxy/dp/B00OUK0N26/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1530569809&sr=1-1&keywords=anker+powerdrive+5

For testing, I normally use a couple of Anker 20100 packs - have a read at this thread, especially the recent posts... http://forum.pilotaware.com/index.php/topic,9.msg15362.html#msg15362

2). The Rosetta Bridge has a 5v Out supply, (marked on the board) to which I have connected a small fan, though this is not an ‘official’ mod, so if you decide to do so, be careful.

3). I can’t say yet whether the Pi3B+ Board is more efficient as I haven’t had time to test that yet. I’ll let you know if/when I do.

Regards

Peter

 N.B. for the benefit of anyone else reading this we have (as you would expect) done some preliminary testing with the newer Raspberry Pi3B+, but the current PAW software won’t run on it.
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Admin on July 03, 2018, 10:14:10 am
Hi Adi
So looks like only certain battery packs will do and my Rav packs are not good enough 😭

Did somebody recommend this type of powerpack ?
I am unfamiliar with this, we only recommend Anker and Charge2/4

Thx
Lee
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: brinzlee on July 03, 2018, 10:52:56 am
Hi Lee
Can you tell me a bit more about the throttling procedure.....Does the display throttling only remain while there is an under power condition..... I have just noticed I also have this condition albeit with the twin SDR's (low power), a juicebitz 20 AWG cable......and anker 20000mAH battery.....I have also run it from a known 2.4a mains power supply and can't remove the condition....what effect does it have on the processor...? And once triggered does it remain on the home page or disappear once the correct voltage is reestablished.
Kind regards
Brinsley
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Admin on July 03, 2018, 11:33:07 am
from here: https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=63&t=147781&start=50#p972790

Code: [Select]
0: under-voltage
1: arm frequency capped
2: currently throttled
16: under-voltage has occurred
17: arm frequency capped has occurred
18: throttling has occurred

Brinz - do you get the same effect if you boot with a single SDR ?
Which Low Power SDR have you obtained ?
I recall there is a v1 and a v2, we supply the newer version.

Thx
Lee
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on July 03, 2018, 01:06:33 pm
Hi Lee, no, no one recommended the RavPower I have used it for sometime since the internet of things radio board days...

For me I have a V2 purchased directly sometime ago and the one in the Rosetta upgrade kit.

On boot from the non recommended battery throttling is 0x0 shortly after it is 0x50005
Removing either SDR and throttling remains 0x0

On a genuine rpi mains supply and with both SDRs throttling remains 0x0
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Admin on July 03, 2018, 01:25:32 pm
Hi Adi

One of the SDR was part of the upgrade, did you purchase the second separately ?
I understand there were 2 versions of the LP SDR, the first version was not as low power as the second

Thx
Lee
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on July 03, 2018, 01:40:29 pm
Hi Lee, yes it was a V2 ordered from RTL-SDR, they look identical to apart from the PCB colour!

thanks Adi

Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: brinzlee on July 03, 2018, 03:20:11 pm
Interesting its still throttled with just one SDR low power.....its a v2 by the way....with the blue board.....
I will run some voltage and current consumption diagnostics...I have tried a brand new charged Anker battery with no difference....
Looks like the setup when its settled down is drawing about 0.9A with both SDR's connected not allowing for peaks....but the voltage is dropping down to 4.7v which I guess is the issue....
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Admin on July 03, 2018, 03:22:24 pm
Hi Brinz

Sounds like the cable ?
Do you have another cable to hand to try ?
I presume it is the JuicyBitz, is it the 30cm or 1Metre ?

Thx
Lee
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: brinzlee on July 03, 2018, 03:56:21 pm
Tried multiple JuicyBitz cables...and yes they are the 1 metre ones.....
Just tried it on a wall outlet with USB and now the throttling is 0X0

Will have to sacrifice my home automation RPi, that has a 30cm on it.... :(
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Keithvinning on July 03, 2018, 04:34:22 pm
POWER AGAIN!!! :o
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Paul_Sengupta on July 03, 2018, 10:48:41 pm
Can I just point out that I have a Pi 3 with two standard, non-low-power SDRs in it and I've never had the throttling problem.

I mostly run mine off USB cigarette lighter adaptors though rather than batteries. Both my Anker and EasyAcc batteries seem to work without any throttling though, even with a metre lead.

There may be variations in all the hardware I guess.
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: JCurtis on July 03, 2018, 11:04:27 pm
POWER AGAIN!!! :o

I had a customer get in touch with a iPad slowly discharging when in flight, turned out that despite using an original OEM cable, it was a little 'mature'.  Enough strands had given up the ghost over the 2 years they had it to compromise the power.  They are designed to be flexible, with a high number of very fine strands of wire to make up each cable core.  These will fracture over time. 

So treat USB cables as consumable, especially if they get moved around.

Needles to say a swap of the USB cable they were using restored everything back to normal.
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Ian Melville on July 04, 2018, 08:23:59 am
Like Paul I have been running two standard SDR on a Pi2 and Pi3, from a 10Ah Anker pack with a 1m Juicebitz lead with no power issues.
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: brinzlee on July 04, 2018, 08:38:39 am
Interesting comments Gentlemen....all taken on board. The only variation I have, I believe is an external gps glued to the top of the case but I’m sure that wouldn’t draw more current than the standard one. I will do some more investigations today. And let you know
Lee I couldn’t decipher that link you sent me referring to the power codes....
What is the difference between 0x0 and 0x50005 and 0x50000
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: PaulSS on July 04, 2018, 09:32:06 am
This was in one of Lee's old posts:


Quote
Hi Gareth,
That is pretty important, what it is detecting is an undervoltage issue
I will add more info to the warnings in the next release, but basically, these are individual bitmasks (techie speak)

Code: [Select]
0x00000001 under-voltage
0x00000002 arm frequency capped
0x00000004 currently throttled
0x00010000 under-voltage has occurred
0x00020000 arm frequency capped has occurred
0x00040000 throttling has occurred

0x50000 means that undervoltage was detected, and throttling occured at some time
0x50005 means that undervoltage is detected, and throttling is applied
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Admin on July 04, 2018, 09:51:02 am
Hi Brinz
looks like Paul found one of my old descriptions, does this make sense ?

Thx
Lee
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: brinzlee on July 04, 2018, 09:59:17 am
That does make sense thanks Guys......so what does 0x0 mean.....it that system ok
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Admin on July 04, 2018, 10:10:16 am
That does make sense thanks Guys......so what does 0x0 mean.....it that system ok
yes, I will make this clearer in a future release.

So coming back to your original issue, do you have access to any voltage measuring equipment
I think we need to understand is it
- battery
- cable
- additional loading from SDR

I should add, the system will probably continue to function, but this is an indicator that it could be 'on the edge'

Thx
Lee
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: brinzlee on July 04, 2018, 12:15:22 pm
Ok just tried again using a 50cm JuiceBitz and we have a happy throttled 0x0.....So I'm guessing again but the current draw on a Pi3 B and SDR's is too much now for a 1 metre long cable and Anker Battery combination....Again I would imagine if the battery eliminator devices (cigarette lighter adapter, Charge4 device) are dishing out slightly higher voltage and sustaining over 2.1a the 1 metre cable might still work.....
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Paul_Sengupta on July 04, 2018, 02:35:32 pm
Do a search for "USB tester" (https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_sop=15&_nkw=usb+tester&LH_PrefLoc=2&_pgn=2&_skc=200&rt=nc) on e-bay. I find they can be quite useful.
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: JCurtis on July 04, 2018, 06:55:48 pm
Do a search for "USB tester" (https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_sop=15&_nkw=usb+tester&LH_PrefLoc=2&_pgn=2&_skc=200&rt=nc) on e-bay. I find they can be quite useful.

Be wary of those devices, they are not always accurate and introduce quite a drop on the output.  So while they may measure what comes out of the USB port, it bears no relation to what the device at the end of the cable is actually getting.

Ok just tried again using a 50cm JuiceBitz and we have a happy throttled 0x0.....So I'm guessing again but the current draw on a Pi3 B and SDR's is too much now for a 1 metre long cable and Anker Battery combination....Again I would imagine if the battery eliminator devices (cigarette lighter adapter, Charge4 device) are dishing out slightly higher voltage and sustaining over 2.1a the 1 metre cable might still work.....

Charge2 and Charge4 are set for a nominal 5.25v output, to help with voltage drop.  They will also generate this regardless of load.  The USB spec says a high power port must be between 4.75v to 5.25v, although this may be going up to 5.5v.  When checking a port it must ALWAYS be under load, just like checking a battery, the voltage means nothing unless it's under load.
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on July 05, 2018, 02:08:37 pm
@Lee re voltage measurements:

Driven from my RavPower (unrecommended battery)
Pi 3B
Single SDR 4.94V throttling 0x0 (none) - measured before the two SDR test.
Two SDRs 4.82V Throttling changing between 0X5000 (throttling has occurred) and 0x50005 (being throttled)
Single SDR 4.94 Throttling 0x0 - measured after the 2 SDR test in case of battery fade!

The voltage was measured with a DVM off the solder pads under the Micro USB port after the hotspot was active and the client connected to view home screen.
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Admin on July 05, 2018, 04:47:24 pm
Hi Adi

Interesting, I wonder what effect the cable is having (referring back to Jeremy's post)
I presume it is JuicyBitz - is it 0.5M or 1.0M ?
and how old is it

IIRC the under-voltage occurs when voltage drops below 4.8V
Also this is instantaneous voltage which is difficult to measure without equipment which can have multiple samples.

Also, I would have thought the better place to measure the voltage would have been on one of the 4xUSB

Thx
Lee
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: exfirepro on July 05, 2018, 04:54:45 pm
Hi All,

I'm not disputing Jeremy's advice in any way as I fully understand and accept his reasoning, but I'm surprised you are finding cable length so critical. I have run my Rosetta on test at home from my Standard Anker batteries with 2 x SDRs and a fan on a (fairly new) 2 metre JuicEbitz 20AWG cable with no ill effects whatsoever.

Keep up the testing though - the info is all useful.

Best Regards

Peter
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: JCurtis on July 05, 2018, 05:26:28 pm
I'm not disputing Jeremy's advice in any way as I fully understand and accept his reasoning,

You can try, but its the laws of physics you'd end up having the argument with.... {possibly say this line in a strong Scottish accent whilst looking worried}

but I'm surprised you are finding cable length so critical. I have run my Rosetta on test at home from my Standard Anker batteries with 2 x SDRs and a fan on a (fairly new) 2 metre JuicEbitz 20AWG cable with no ill effects whatsoever.

The voltage drop is directly proportional to a combination of cable size (thickness and length) and current.

There are various calculators available but for example...

5v, 2 Amps, 1m 20AWG cable means you would expect to see 4.87v at the other end
5v, 2 Amps, 2m 20AWG cable means you would expect to see 4.73v at the other end

5v, 2 Amps, 1m 22AWG cable means you would expect to see 4.79v at the other end
5v, 2 Amps, 2m 22AWG cable means you would expect to see 4.58v at the other end

This is just the cable, then you have to throw in the USB connectors themselves, which are good for another drop of ~0.2v - 0.4v depending on quality etc.  It doesn't take too much effort to make a 20awg cable a 22awg cable with age and flexing.
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: brinzlee on July 05, 2018, 05:41:01 pm
So I have also run the same test......but measuring voltage from one of the four USB ports and my figures are as follows

50cm JuiceBitz USB cable.....with an Anker Power Bank model B30224. 22400maH on the port supplying 2.4A max
Pi 3B
Single SDR v2    4.91V Throttling 0x0 (none) - measured before the two SDR test.
Two SDRs v2      4.84V Throttling 0X0

100cm JuiceBitz USB cable with Red Plugs.....with an Anker Power Bank model B30224. 22400maH on the port supplying 2.4A max
Pi 3B
Single SDR v2    4.85V Throttling 0x0 (none) - measured before the two SDR test.
Two SDRs v2      4.83V Throttling 0X50000

In my case CABLES !!!
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: JCurtis on July 05, 2018, 06:06:11 pm
Also this is instantaneous voltage which is difficult to measure without equipment which can have multiple samples.

I can do 50,000 samples a second and the DMM is calibrated. Happy to run through a few tests if it helps get some data, just need the stuff that needs to be tested.
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: brinzlee on July 05, 2018, 06:15:54 pm
I think I've found a Chinese importer that can make 1 metre USB cables out of this.....he said terminating it is 'no problem' in a thick Chinese accent...
However weight and balance could be an issue !!!
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: JCurtis on July 05, 2018, 06:29:31 pm
Nah, thats a cable for laying under water, no good altitude....  ;D
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: exfirepro on July 05, 2018, 07:07:52 pm
Thanks Scotty Jeremy,

I’m really glad I said I wasn’t disputing your advice....  :-[  :-\

Best Regards

Peter
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on July 05, 2018, 10:56:36 pm
my current cable is 50cm JuiceBitz USB cable 50cm

I have so 10cm 20awgs on order from JuiceBitz!

yes the cable is quite old, so it could well be that...

I messured the voltage at that point as wanted to know pre Pi power supply what the cable and battery was delivering under load.


At our head office I have access to a LSA that I believe can measure voltage over time among other things, but I will wait for the cables to try first.

I did read on a PI forum of some one adding a buck dc-dc step up and uping the voltage at the battery end to 5.1v or 5.25v. not sure if that would be a worth while experiment or not?

Or if the more efficient power supply on the 3B+ would help I have a Pi 3b+ if any testing would help?
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: AlanG on July 09, 2018, 08:25:37 pm
Whilst not  disputing or detracting from any advise given above I have read much recently about the various battery packs becoming "smart" and controlling the power/current output to smooth out spikes etc.
I wonder if this may have some affect on peak demands from PAW being smoothed out.
My packs are older and pre this terminology and I have never experienced this problem.  I use an Anker Powedrive 5 in the aircraft but I believe even the latest incarnation of these have the "smart" technology.
I've no idea if this has any bearing on the problem but thought it worth a mention.
Alan
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: JCurtis on July 09, 2018, 09:30:49 pm
Whilst not  disputing or detracting from any advise given above I have read much recently about the various battery packs becoming "smart" and controlling the power/current output to smooth out spikes etc.
I wonder if this may have some affect on peak demands from PAW being smoothed out.
My packs are older and pre this terminology and I have never experienced this problem.  I use an Anker Powedrive 5 in the aircraft but I believe even the latest incarnation of these have the "smart" technology.
I've no idea if this has any bearing on the problem but thought it worth a mention.
Alan

It is the device that decides how much power to draw, regardless of supply.  If the device decides to try and draw more than the supply can handle you will get problems.  All schemes such a PowerIQ are there to identify to the end device that is it connected to a fully leaded supply and therefore is free to pull as much as it can.  This is done by fiddling with the D+/D- lines.  Mine do similar things looking to tell the end device that it is free to pull as much power as it wants.  If something works totally outside the specs (looking at you Samsung...) you can put a customised profile on one or more ports on my units to counter this.

The Pi doesn't have the D+/D- pins connected, as it's not looking to charge but be a "Power Thief" under the standards, just a device hungry for power.  The specs say any device attached to a USB port should be limited until identified, although in general chargers don't do this but the likes of laptops etc. do.  Most of the time such chargers will simply connect the output power direct without interruption (not a good idea for a number of reasons) so things like the Pi will work fine up to a point.

What is unknown is if the negotiation fails under PowerIQ (as it must, as the pins aren't connected) does it actually impose a limit or just let the end device draw what it wants.  As they say there is per port protection of some kind, and they can increase the voltage on a per port basis too (up to 12v for the latest ones), these newer supplies must regulate the supply on a per port basis.  If I get time I'll get hold of one and stick it on the bench to see what happens, be an interesting experiment.

The Pi (and PAW) usage is 'spiky' needing a supply be to be able to have fast transient response.  Chargers generally don't handle that too well, they are designed to supply a steady state to charge a battery after all.  The end device is powered by the battery, and the supply charges the battery.  The electronics in the likes of a phone or tablet handle this in the background, the input power doesn't go into the device direct.  This is why so many of the cheap wung-hung-lo chargers can damage the charging ICs on modern devices, they identify they can do everything but physically can't and their output is so poor it knackers the charging IC over time.

I did spot their VoltageBoost description...

Quote
VoltageBoost™ is an Anker-exclusive technology that compensates for cable resistance by smoothing voltage output.
Other chargers have their speeds reduced by cable resistance. With the effects of cable resistance mitigated by VoltageBoost™,
your device receives its fastest possible charging speed, every single time.

...which is meaningless, smoothing output has noting to do with resistance.  I suspect this got a bit mangled in translation!
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Paul_Sengupta on July 10, 2018, 01:00:30 am
I think increasing, rather than smoothing!
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Boxkite on August 30, 2018, 01:29:57 pm
Hi W

Be careful standard Y cables wont fit into the Rosetta Case. This is because the parallel connection is done at the SMA end and the ones that we have seen on t'internet are too big and bulky.

We are having some made to our specification to avoid this.

If you are lucky and get one that is not big and bulky and fits like Cinderella's slipper let us know.
Any update on this? Thanks.
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: neilmurg on September 12, 2018, 02:03:26 pm
These are the ones I ordered https://www.aliexpress.com/item/SMA-TS9-Adapter-SMA-Female-to-Y-type-2-X-TS9-Male-Connector-Splitter-Combiner-Cable/1000001913663.html (https://www.aliexpress.com/item/SMA-TS9-Adapter-SMA-Female-to-Y-type-2-X-TS9-Male-Connector-Splitter-Combiner-Cable/1000001913663.html)

Make sure you select the RG316 option for the SMA to MCX
Great, thanks. But, which length? I guess 15cm is OK, that's what I had already in the single.
Any progress on the "Y" connector that was in the pipeline?

I have 3 spare Pi 2's / wifi / oldSDR and a couple of aerials I can donate to the OGN-R program if that's helpful. Send to the usual Rosetta DIY upgrade address?
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: Wadoadi on September 16, 2018, 09:20:18 am
Great, thanks. But, which length? I guess 15cm is OK, that's what I had already in the single.
Any progress on the "Y" connector that was in the pipeline?

I have 3 spare Pi 2's / wifi / oldSDR and a couple of aerials I can donate to the OGN-R program if that's helpful. Send to the usual Rosetta DIY upgrade address?

Sorry for the late reply, yes the 15cm option is what I ordered.
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade
Post by: neilmurg on September 16, 2018, 09:53:22 am
:-) thanks
I ordered the 20cm, there doesn't seem to be an SMA / MCX rg316 15cm any more on that page
Title: Re: Rosetta upgrade (upgrading past Rosetta)
Post by: neilmurg on March 07, 2019, 10:48:05 am
Looking at parts for the 'Y' splitter connector and the 2 low power SDR's? Someone asked where I got mine.

These are current:
Y connector / SMA Female to Y Type 2X MCX male RA Splitter Jumper pigtail RG316 cable 6in(15cm)
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/302453497716

and the low power radio:
https://www.passion-radio.com/rtl-sdr-stick/stratux-519.html
there may be cheaper low power SDRs out there, but it's not clear to me whether the SDR being offered on other sites are the low power versions.