PilotAware
British Forum => General Discussion => Topic started by: RobertPBham on December 21, 2018, 07:21:13 pm
-
Hi all,
Just a quick one - I know I've seen this somewhere before but cannot now find it!
What do all the messages in the track log file indicate - e.g. $PFLAA, $PAWRT, $PGRMZ, $GPGGA etc.
The reason I'm asking is I've been trying new RAM mounts for PAW and positions and don't think I saw any Mode C/S targets today - understandable as the weather was atrocious and I must have been one of the mad few flying.
Anyway, I'm just trying to ascertain is the positioning is good/correct but cannot work out, what is ADSB, Mode C/S etc.
Thanks
Rob
-
Hi Rob
$PFLAA is a FLARM standard and can be found in a document called "FLARM Data Port Specification". we cannot link to this document, but a Google search will find it.
$GPGGA is an NMEA standard sentence http://aprs.gids.nl/nmea/
$PGRMZ is a Garmin proprietary sentence. Not sure if this is published?
$PAWRT is PAW Diagnostics and provides tagged information to better understand the FLARM messages
for example
$PAWRT,4B19D1,1,1,1,1,0,0,*4BThis says the ICAO/Code 4B19D1 is transmitting 1,1,1,1,0,0
Mode-A, Mode-C, Mode-S, Mode-S/ES, PilotAware, Flarm
-
Hi Rob
Please take a look at the traffic page to see what is received
This is documented in the full operating instructions
Thx
Lee
-
Thanks Ian - I’ll have a look!
Hi Lee,
I understand the details are on the traffic page, however, checking that while running SkyDemon, in cloud on an RNAV approach in to Cranfield is easier said than done! :-) I heard a few radio calls for traffic around Cranfield and suspect they would have been Mode S, but didn’t receive any notification - they weren’t close, but ahead, from the calls and I just wanted to check that PAW had received the signal even though they may have been filtered by my settings (not close enough or at a concerning height).
As I’ve repositioned the PAW on a window RAM mount in the rear, I just wanted to be ‘more’ certain it is in a good place and hence checking the track log would show the planes detected even if not alerted!
Thanks
Rob
-
Hi Rob
for Mode-S and Mode-C, the trk file will ONLY contain those targets for which a notification is provided, visual or audio. So this is post filtering, the traffic screen is pre-filtering.
actually if you know the ICAO code, that will be recorded in the trk file irrespective of whether a warning is generated, the PAWRT sentences provide a registry of all aircraft seen.
thx
Lee
-
Thanks Lee - I’ll have a proper look through the log!
-
FLARM_DataportManual_v3.02E.pdf (http://delta-omega.com/download/EDIA/FLARM_DataportManual_v3.02E.pdf)
http://aprs.gids.nl/nmea/ (http://aprs.gids.nl/nmea/)
https://www.gpsinformation.org/dale/nmea.htm (https://www.gpsinformation.org/dale/nmea.htm)
-
Hi Rob
$PFLAA is a FLARM standard and can be found in a document called "FLARM Data Port Specification". we cannot link to this document, but a Google search will find it.
$GPGGA is an NMEA standard sentence http://aprs.gids.nl/nmea/
$PGRMZ is a Garmin proprietary sentence. Not sure if this is published?
$PAWRT is PAW Diagnostics and provides tagged information to better understand the FLARM messages
for example
$PAWRT,4B19D1,1,1,1,1,0,0,*4BThis says the ICAO/Code 4B19D1 is transmitting 1,1,1,1,0,0
Mode-A, Mode-C, Mode-S, Mode-S/ES, PilotAware, Flarm
Is there an update for the $PAWRT message?
It now seems to be a $PALOG as per:
$PALOG,20190623,171428,PAWRT,A19155,1,A,1,C,1,S,0,ES,0,P,0,F,0,U,0,M,01,valid,02,vers,03,nacp,01,nica,00,sil,00,sils,*02
I take it that this reads: date, time, paw diag, a/c hex, yes, ModeA, yes, ModeC, yes, ModeS, no, ModeSES, no, PAw, no, FLARM, no, ?, no, (big dunno{NACp and uncertainty stuff})
[edit] update:
date, time, paw diag, a/c hex,{yes, ModeA}, {yes, ModeC}, {yes, ModeS}, {no, ADSB}, {no, PAw}, {no, FLARM}, {no, Uplink}, {no, MLAT}, {NACp and uncertainty stuff})
-- after reading the Lee's reply below VVVV
[/edit]
-
U indicates Uplink from an OGNR rather than direct
Thx
Ler
-
Using Aircrew analyser and PAW with the latest software.
I could ask a number of questions but here is the first one.
Considering my flight into Lee on Solent yesterday I note using Aircrew an aircraft well ahead of me to land with P U M codes, ie no C no S codes - how does U and M come about ??? (SkyDemon also displayed it whilst I was flying but I did not bother to look closely at the Ipad as the Pilot of the said aircraft was giving good and timely position reports). Presumably it's a problem with Aircrew ? It certainly looked like U data being used as the profile was not smooth like an aircraft with a P designation.
-
It would be great if there was a tool to analyse .trk files to give totals of:
PAw, ADSB, Mode S MLAT, FLARM, Mode S, Mode C 'seen' on a flight.
Which we could then share
I had a look after downloading some .trk's to a spreadsheet. I got a bit lost and my macro / programming skills have atrophied. I may try again.
-
It would be great if there was a tool to analyse .trk files to give totals of:
PAw, ADSB, Mode S MLAT, FLARM, Mode S, Mode C 'seen' on a flight.
Which we could then share
I had a look after downloading some .trk's to a spreadsheet. I got a bit lost and my macro / programming skills have atrophied. I may try again.
Hi Neil
The track file does not contain "Mode S, Mode C 'seen' on a flight.", it only contains those which generated a warning to the navigation device
The numbers for seen are pretty big for Mode-S, and non-sensical for Mode-C, because they cannot be attributed to an aircraft
Thx
Lee
-
That's what I'd be looking for Lee, ones inside my reporting envelope, 2000ft and 5km
-
That's what I'd be looking for Lee, ones inside my reporting envelope, 2000ft and 5km
Ah OK, I understood you were asking 'seen' as my notion of 'detected', whereas I think what you are seeing is - 'seen' is judged as a 'threat', is that correct ?
Thx
Lee
-
That's what I'd be looking for Lee, ones inside my reporting envelope, 2000ft and 5km
Ah OK, I understood you were asking 'seen' as my notion of 'detected', whereas I think what you are seeing is - 'seen' is judged as a 'threat', is that correct ?
Correct. Then I have an idea of the proportion of reportable/threat aircraft in each category. ADSB/FLARM/MLAT/ ModeC-S
-
Hi SGS66,
The U represents data Uplinked from a OGN-R ground station.
U M indicates that this was an MLAT(ed) aircraft
(U G would indicate a Flarm aircraft)
Due to the way in which a MLAT position is calculated from triangulation from various base stations, this can cause the track to appear not smooth.
This is not actually a problem of the Aircrew playback, but a function of the MLAT position calculation.
Deker.
Using Aircrew analyser and PAW with the latest software.
I could ask a number of questions but here is the first one.
Considering my flight into Lee on Solent yesterday I note using Aircrew an aircraft well ahead of me to land with P U M codes, ie no C no S codes - how does U and M come about ??? (SkyDemon also displayed it whilst I was flying but I did not bother to look closely at the Ipad as the Pilot of the said aircraft was giving good and timely position reports). Presumably it's a problem with Aircrew ? It certainly looked like U data being used as the profile was not smooth like an aircraft with a P designation.
-
Deker,
Let me put the question another way - why is a paw
aircraft being reported to me as U M with a jerky profile ?
Phil
-
Hi sgs66
I presume you read and understood the mode-s/3d document before enabling the feature ?
So this is based upon mlat, much more accurate than bearing less
Not quite as accurate as gps, hence some of the calculation errors
Thx
Lee
-
Hi SGS66,
The U represents data Uplinked from a OGN-R ground station.
U M indicates that this was an MLAT(ed) aircraft
(U G would indicate a Flarm aircraft)
SGS66 said that aircrew showed the target as PUM, implying it was a Pilotaware emitter.
As I understand it the aircraft is an MLAT'd target, not a PAw aircraft. SGS also knows this, he already indicated that the targets track implies MLAT. He's asking about the contradictory indication.
I don't know if Skydemon would show it as Pilotaware and MLAT, or what PAw radar would show
-
Did it show P from the beginning? It might have been uplinked MLAT to start with then, as a PAW user, came into direct range?
Or does anything uplinked show P anyway as it's being received through the bridge?
-
I had an odd one but on a similar vein a few days ago.
Aircraft approached me and was shown as derived from MLAT, but then became a red ring. Alternate text on SD still showed it as MLAT. Spotted a second one later on.
Short Video of GBPAY
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/hrf0moj1snditu5/AADnGCGqfJaDoRwG2UxFd9Y5a?dl=0
Folder contains screenshots and log file as well Lee. The earlier track file shows GSKKY which is the one that first alerted me to this.
-
The flags are ‘sticky’, which means they latch
So in Ians case what was showing was an aircraft which historically had received mlat
This was no longer valid, but direct bearingless was valid
If you look at the traffic screen, and there is no figure for distance
Then it is bearingless
Not sure if it is clear. But P is set from a rebroadcast as well
So PUM, mlat uplinked via Pilotaware
Thx
Lee
-
Any particular reason why they are ‘sticky’?
-
Can I guess?
If message sentences are incomplete, after several repeats the full sentence will become fully populated
-
Lee,
Can I suggest in the combined code P U M, the code U is redundant and the P is misleading. M says it all, this data must be uplinked to our PAW equipment from a ground station, so M is enough.
Then you could use the P code when it is a true P-P interaction.
What is more M also implies A,C,S so code M speaks volumes.
Phil